Security using arrest to break our resistance – Rubongoya

DAVID LEWIS RUBONGOYA, the secretary general of National Unity Platform political party, has said government is using arrests, detentions, and abductions to break their resolve to oppose them.

Speaking to The Observer in an interview, Rubongoya who was arrested recently but later released, said more than 100 of their supporters are either in illegal detentions, were abducted or are still languishing in prison for nothing more than standing up against the government. MUHAMMAD KAKEMBO transcribed the interview and below are the excerpts.

You have been one of the most vocal critics against arrests of NUP supporters; but a fortnight ago you also became a victim; how were you treated when you were in the military and later police custody?

Those guys are very violent, especially when they are taking you; you saw the manner in which we were grabbed and thrown into the drone. Actually, I got a small injury on my leg because when I sat in one of the seats at the front, the guy came and said move to the back and then they dragged me because they don’t have time to tell you that now move peacefully.

I think that drone that should have capacity of about 10 people had about 17 people all packed in there. I asked this guy seated next to me why they do these things. You see the guy all of a sudden change from the one who was speaking violently and now he calms down. If it was a longer distance, yes maybe, he would have expressed his own frustration but you could see these things they do they don’t even like them.

At the police of course myself and Hon Ssenyonyi were taken to the office of the OC Operations while the other guys were taken to cells immediately. We spent about an hour in the office of OC Operations and then they picked us and took us into the cells where we found our  ther comrades. In the evening, we were released together with our comrades because we insisted that we cannot leave without everybody we were arrested with.

Why are you hard on the security people when you know they are working under instructions?

They are robots, they are working against the people of Uganda if Museveni is in State House and me, I cannot interface with him and he has sent either the OC or whoever to pick me up, then my anger will be directed at the immediate person that has come to pick me up.

But also, the violence which they use when executing these orders is appalling. They try to please their masters. What was wrong for them to come to us and say, you people are under arrest, they bring a police vehicle and say move in and only use reasonable force like the law says if we try resisting.

There are some of your party supporters who have been in detention for years; what was going on in your head while you were at police?

I must say that in this country when you are arrested, you don’t know how it will end. I was preparing my mind for whatever will happen because you know in this country these guys could take you and you think you will spend hours and you end up spending years when you are in this situation you think about Ssewanyana and Ssegirinya, you think about the Olivia Lutaayas and you have to mentally prepare yourself for whatever will come.

When you are in there, you start thinking about family, you start thinking about especially the nature of our economy where people live hands to mouth; you start thinking how will your people survive if you are taken away for a month or two months.

These things occur to you but of course once you involve yourself in this work, you never end a day without thinking that you would be arrested, tortured, disappeared or even killed. I know that’s what has happened to so many people now.

Speaking about arrests, how many of your people are in security custody as of now?

The numbers keep fluctuating and the reason is because some people are released everyday while others are arrested and others are abducted on a daily basis. But I want to say this; there is a clear difference between those who are arrested and those abducted. Those who were abducted during elections up to now and are nowhere to be seen are 18 but since then, I think over 100 of our supporters have been abducted at different points and either released, others just freed without even any single document.

In the Uganda Human Rights Commission report given by [chairperson, Mariam] Wangadya the other day, she talks about 12 people who we had reported to them as missing at some point. She was not ashamed to even put that list there showing clearly that someone was picked up and they spent three months in detention and then eventually was released on police bond. Since the election ended many other supporters of ours have been arrested.

Right now there is a young man called Alex Kalyowa Kayiwa who was picked up in July up to now he is nowhere to be seen. There is a court order issued by Justice Musa Ssekaana for habeas corpus which was taken to SIU Kireka and they said they have so many such court orders which they decided to ignore.

We also have another group who are in prison like Olivia Lutaaya. On her file, there are other 32, of which four were granted bail after spending two years in detention, meaning on that file, 28 people are still in detention. There are a group of 11 people who are at Luzira Upper, there are others who are at Murchison Bay including Saanya, Katale Swaib and others.

On October 5 when our president was returning, they picked up around 300 people. Although some are out on police bond, others have never been brought in court. There is a group which is being tried in Nabweru court. Our human rights office keeps track of these cases.

The elections are behind us; why do you think arrests are still going on?

The reason has not changed, the regime is sending fear to the population. Most of these people who have been picked up, when they are taken in those facilities, regime officials try to compromise them. We have heard these stories from many of those who have been released.

So, they arrest them in order to compromise them, to send fear into the population, as repressive tactic and portray this image of power that they can do anything. So, a person who has been arrested and kept in detention for months will think twice before engaging in activism.

How do you sieve the people who claim that they are your supporters and that they were arrested for their political views, and not any other thing?

We have a very stringent system of verification of case here. I will tell you that the regime has sent us not less than 10 people in the last one year to try and lie that they are victims. There was even a police officer who came and gave us a very interesting story; he had scars and he claimed he got them form CMI.

Eventually, we got to know that he was an operative. Even this week, there was a young man who came here and said he had been abducted by CMI but when we did due diligence because we also have contacts in the regime, we found that he was lying.

So, many of those arrested by CMI are actually given discharge forms at SIU Kireka. But there are also those who are not charged at all; these we do more verification to establish whether they had been arrested or not.

When your supporters are arrested and then released, do they come back the same people or their will to engage in activism is broken?

There are different responses to repression as there are human beings. There are others who come back with more resolve. Some are feared being arrested so much but the first time they are arrested, it breaks their fear that when they come out, they are more resolute than before they went to prison.

But there are also those who come back subdued because of torture and the horrors or prison. But the good thing is that we have counselling services for these comrades to help them overcome the trauma. But I must say that majority of the cases I have seen, people have come out more resolute.

We have seen the debate of human rights violations playing out in parliament. The opposition has actually walked out vowing not to return until these issues are resolved.

What is your feeling about what is happening in parliament?

We are very happy with our parliamentary team for the step they have taken. This is what we have been saying for the last three years that citizens can’t be taken just like that to facilities that are not gazetted in law and its business as usual.

We are happy and we hope that they increase more pressure. Not that we expect much from that parliament, but it has cameras on it both local and international. So, when they take a firm stand on a matter, it speaks volume.

mmkakembo@gmail.com